Ross Jeffries day game classic NLP pickup.. - Page 3 - Pick-up Artist Forum

nova · 28-05-2010, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zone

What are you talking about nova i never said that lol.

Aye, I need to stop manipulating your wording Zone

Tom · 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zone

Psychological manipulation is a type of social influence that aims to change the perception or behavior of others.

Have you ever tried to act more confident around women.

I know what it means no need to paste from Wikipedia, you missed the "... through underhanded, deceptive, or even abusive tactics."
So I don't see how being genuine is manipulation, in fact I'm genuinely baffled you can take that stance.

And yes I try to be more confident around anyone, it's all about improving myself. I may not be there yet but if I can be a more genuine confident person, great! Don't you want that too?

Being confident and expressing my self is not manipulative, in fact it's the opposite. If you're truthful you'll express weaknesses you have and opinions which might not conform to social norms. I just told a group of workmates I bought a book on the Spanish civil war, the old me would have shied away from this in case I seemed geeky but i'm being truthful with them and not manipulating them.

Ali · 28-05-2010, 01:46 PM

I think it's great and ppl saying it's spooky or wierd, WTF I mean what's bad about 2ppl feeling good???

Ok the way he picks up women is methodical/scriptted etc but the result is happiness for all involved.

Zone · 28-05-2010, 05:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom

I know what it means no need to paste from Wikipedia.

I thought i was the only one with access to wikipedia

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom

And yes I try to be more confident around anyone,

If your consciously trying to be more confident, then your consciously trying to manipulate there perception of you, I think thats ok, my point is manipulation is not necessary a bad thing.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tom

I just told a group of workmates I bought a book on the Spanish civil war, the old me would have shied away from this in case I seemed geeky but i'm being truthful with them and not manipulating them.

No that is not manipulating, if you lied that would be manipulation.

Blanca · 28-05-2010, 05:02 PM

As Kowalski has said, Zone, my argument (facetious though it may be) is valid. If we are defining what is good with "what works", as Milton was apparently doing, then why not rape? It gets you laid! If you want an end that justifies the means, rape is a perfectly sound tactic.

Anywho, this NLP stuff. The way I see is it is this. Supposing you walked into a Ferrari dealership and NLPed the guy into giving you a Ferrari. For nothing. Acceptable? What if you did it in the pizza place to get a free pizza? Or to get away with not buying a train ticket? You'd be tricking someone into giving you what you want.

What about sex? As far as I'm concerned there is little or no difference between hypnotising a bloke into giving you a tenner and hypnotising a girl into bed. You're using hypnosis to get what you want, possibly against the girl's wishes. Even if we drop the whole "PUA ethics" of the situation and use our moral compass, hypnotising a girl into bed is wrong. I don't care what (if any) religion you follow, if you think hypnotising a girl into bed is an acceptable thing to do, you need to re-evaluate how you see the world.

Zone · 28-05-2010, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blanca

then why not rape? It gets you laid! If you want an end that justifies the means, rape is a perfectly sound tactic.
.

Its called speed seduction not speed rape, creating attraction and to suduce, is a skill, anything he teaches is not taking away a womens free will, I think your really deluded if you think his techniques are comparable to rape. To think bad of someone so you can feel good about yourself is my perception of wants going on here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blanca

Anywho, this NLP stuff. The way I see is it is this. Supposing you walked into a Ferrari dealership and NLPed the guy into giving you a Ferrari. For nothing. Acceptable? What if you did it in the pizza place to get a free pizza? Or to get away with not buying a train ticket? You'd be tricking someone into giving you what you want.

Unfortunity this techniques are not that powerful, think your mistakin NLP for jedi mind shit, if someone was able to reach that level of skill, they would fucking deserve a Ferrari.

Your ideas on hypnosis are wrong, RJ does not put these women under mind control.

Zone · 28-05-2010, 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ali

I think it's great and ppl saying it's spooky or wierd, WTF I mean what's bad about 2ppl feeling good???

Ok the way he picks up women is methodical/scriptted etc but the result is happiness for all involved.

I Agree.

To many people on here trying to sell there own beliefs, based on inaccurate, ignorant perceptions, of information, to make others look bad.

Tom · 28-05-2010, 07:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zone

If your consciously trying to be more confident, then your consciously trying to manipulate there perception of you, I think thats ok, my point is manipulation is not necessary a bad thing.

I'm not trying to manipulate anyone, it's got nothing to do with them it's about me. I can't express myself if I'm not happy with myself or to put it another way if I'm not confident with myself.
I don't set out to appear confident I am aiming to be genuinely confident which by the definition you quote mined off Wiki is not psychological manipulation.

MiltonErickson · 29-05-2010, 03:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blanca

Oh we don't doubt that it works, but then so does rape, and you wouldn't do that would you?

I'm gonna go out on a limb and assume you have no formal NLP or hypnosis training at all, but I'll ask this question anyhow:
Exactly how is skillfully using language analogous to rape?

kowalski · 06:41 AM

Because there is more to it than whether something works or not.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kowalski

If the measure is 'what works' in terms of getting some kind of 'close', then you leave yourself open to such arguments. The onus is on you to add rejoinder.

Fact is there are moral questions to be dealt with.

Practically everyone I know is privy to my involvement in this community, my ideas and practices. None of them think it is weird and none of them has ever used it against me. Why? Because I'm just working on free expression of my authentic self.

Can you NLPers and MMers say the same? Talk to your mum, sister, any normal (i.e. non-pu social retard) person about using covert hypnosis to engineer social and sexual situations to your advantage and see how fricken wierd they think it is, same goes for any machivalean, manipulative, under the radar tactics and techniques. I have this discussion with all sorts of people all the time and this shit creeps people out. If it was all normal and fine and cool and good there wouldn't be any need to hide it from friends or family or for it to be done on people covertly or under the radar.

You can live in bad faith and convince yourself that you are enlightened and they are not, or that everyone manipulates everyone else all the time, or all communication is hypnosis, or whatever other argument you want to use to justify your sociopathic behaviour. It is all nonsense.

PUA, and the internets in general, has a lot to answer for in terms of justifying and giving acceptablity to fucked up shit like this.

What makes it even more interesting is that there's no properly submissable evidence that any of this even works. So you are probably being both creepy and ineffectual.

Peace,

kowalski